EP 70. Keep Walking: Transformative Gratitude with Jake Thomas

In this episode, we interview Jake Thomas, a Marine veteran and founder of Keep Walking. Jake shares his journey from growing up as a Navy brat to enlisting in the Marine Corps straight out of high school. He provides insights into his deployment experiences in Iraq during the initial invasion and reflects on the challenges of transitioning back to civilian life. The conversation delves into humorous boot camp memories, the impact of faith during tough times, and the broader implications of military service. Jake also discusses his role as a social media creator, highlighting the transformative power of gratitude and the positive momentum gained in the creative space with his platform, Keep Walking. Join us for a candid exploration of Jake's life journey, both within and beyond the military.

Sponsors:
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Transcript

Welcome to Behind the Lava Lava, the podcast that takes you behind the scenes of the vibrant people and cultures of the Pacific. I'm your host, Michael Tan, and I'm joined today by my co host, Milford Tiafala. This episode is brought to you by Matai Watches, a luxury timepiece brand that embodies the essence of the Pacific Islands.

We'll be kicking it with... Jake Thomas, a fellow Marine veteran and creator of Keep Walking on social media.  So Jake, can you  briefly introduce yourself?  Yeah, absolutely. , my name is Jake Thomas. Like you said, I'm also a Marine veteran, did eight years in the Marine Corps Infantry. 

Got out, got a job with the Department of Energy and I live in Amarillo, Texas and started the platform Keep Walking.  So I like to start off our conversations with An icebreaker question, and today's icebreaker question is,  What would you do if you noticed that there is no toilet paper while using a public toilet? 

uh, that's what socks are for, right? You got two of them?  You'll be good with one. So, I've been in a situation  when I was in the military, , I've used my underwear. So that was the only solution that I could come up with, especially if it's a, it's a public stall and there's nothing in that stall.

So what else can you use but your underwear?  What about you Jake?  I think I'd go with shirt sleeve. I mean, you just take them both off. Maybe you're just trying to get some sun on your arms, you know? So let's, let's think of some creative ways. What else can we use? Let's say we were like something random was in the, in the, in the bathroom.

What will we use? I mean, I guess you could use an empty toilet paper roll. It  wouldn't be very forgiving, but you could get after  I know back in the day,  in, in the Pacific Islands, back in Samoa,  I'm pretty sure there were a lot of leaves around.  Back in the outhouses. So, uh, I'll be using the leaves.

What about you, T? Uh, there's paper towels, just wet them,  wet whatever you got in there. I don't know, man.   Use what you can.  let's get straight into it. So Jake, can you tell us about your genesis, where you're from, uh, where you were born and where you grew up?  Yeah, absolutely. I was born in San Diego, California in the old Balboa hospital.

My dad was in the Navy.  , growing up, we bounced around a lot.  So Southern California up to the Pacific Northwest into Washington and then cut all over the place. So I was a Navy brat  and  ended up in Washington, which is where I joined the Marine Corps. And that kind of was the catalyst to where I am today. 

What, what about your parents and how many siblings did you have?   So my parents are both from, uh, Northern Utah, just North of Ogden.  , farming town there called Tree Mountain.  Um, I have an older sister. Unfortunately, we've been estranged for many years. But,  I like to say just cause my wife's family being what it is, I picked up seven siblings when I married her.

And they're my family. So, I got a lot of brothers now and a lot of sisters. So, I'm super excited that I have those relationships. Cause I know you, you were in the Marine Corps. Did you join the Marine Corps right after high school? Or, or was there a period where you worked or went to college before you joined? 

Nah, I went straight in. Like, I at least had a little bit of awareness that if I went to college, I wasn't going to go very far.  Like, I'd have been getting in trouble or partying or whatever. Like, I wasn't focused. And so, my big thing was I was going to join the Marine Corps to get away from my dad's rules.

And he just laughed at me and was like, pfft, okay.  Have at it. other, other than your dad's rules, was there another reason for you to join the Marine Corps?   Initially I was going to join the army and they were kind of like, you know, give me the run around and oh, we need this and wait, this isn't going to actually happen the way it's supposed to.

I mean, we all know the game, how the recruiters play the game.  So went across the office to the Marine Corps and was like, Hey, this is what's going on. Can I join? And he was like, sure. I got to watch those two argue with each other  and. He came back with my jacket and  you know, that was that. But I think for me, I was just looking to get out of town, right?

Like I knew college wasn't going to be a thing for me.  And I was tired of just the drama of high school, tired of people who were just real shallow and superficial. And so I was ready to get out. , were you a troublemaker as a youngin growing up? What kind of stuff did you get into?

Absolutely I was. Um, a lot of it,  you know, I was a good kid for the most part. I mean, I was rambunctious and I, you know, I'd get into it. You know, I'm very much that hard headed personality. Like, you can tell me, hey, the stove's hot. Don't touch it. And I'm still going to touch it because I don't believe you.

You know, it won't be hot for me type thing.   But from like  mid teens all the way up until probably 19 or 20 years old, like, like I grew up in a real religious family  and because I realize now in retrospect that I was living kind of on borrowed light,  like it just wasn't for me. And so  I took the approach of, well, whatever they're telling me to do, I'm going to go to the complete opposite. 

So drinking, you know, we hanging out  the whole thing, you know,  and just, that was my approach. And so that was another reason I wanted to leave. I was tired.  Being under somebody else's thumb, and I figured that would be the freedom that I was looking for,  which in some ways it was, in other ways it definitely was not.

And when did you join the Marine Corps? I joined in, uh, 99, in the delayed entry program, and then went to boot camp right after, like, high school graduation. In fact, I turned 18, like, three days in.  , how was your experience back in 99 when you first joined? How, what was the big differences, uh, from when you joined and  from, uh,  19 99 to like  the two thousands. 

Uh, so first, I mean, we were a peacetime Marine Corps and so we obviously had, you know, combat vets in our ranks. Guys that had been some places, um, biggest, you know, conflicts we'd had up until that point were, you know, Mogadishu and Desert Storm,  um, you know, a couple odd deployments here and there for guys who may be in, you know, recon or whatever.

But it was largely peacetime  and so.  It was interesting to go from a peacetime bootcamp, you know, and obviously these guys are trying to square us away and do those things. And  I remember a couple of days into like receiving, you know, when I was on fire watch and this, you know, the DI come up and he was, Hey, where's the other fire watch and me being a stupid kid, you know, I'm, you know, position of attention and I nod my head and go, Oh, he's over here.

And that DI grabbed my cover and like twisted the bill of it and like jammed me against the wall. And he's like, if you ever. Lose your bearing to discipline like that again, I'll end your life. And I'm just like, what did I get myself into?  You know,  and then, you know, go through training, end up in England for one of my first duty stations.

And then 9 11 happened.  And we all knew at that point, we're going to war in some type of capacity. And so it definitely shifted after that.  So I have a question for both of you. So in bootcamp, what memory or shenanigans stood out to you guys? So for me, I remember an incident when everyone went to bed, right? 

And suddenly I was awoken by  a few recruits, , running down to like  two bunk beds, , down. was the first time that I've heard of this thing where they get on one of those sheets. They hold down someone, like each. recruit gets one of the corners of the sheets and hold down, , whoever their target was.

And then they get the sock with the with the soap in it. And then they just went, you know, hit him, hit whoever the recruit they were targeting with. So that incident occurred when I was in,    So the recruits,  uh, went haywire on this recruit they were targeting, and the recruit they were targeting happened to be , quote unquote, the weakest recruit in the platoon.

So they went and beat him up, and then the next morning, those involved were in trouble and sent back  a few, like, companies behind us. So that was my experience.  There was a shenanigans that went on when I was a recruit. What about you guys? Not really shenanigans, but just,  you know, middle of the night, taking a dookie.

And then the D. I. comes,  the first night, comes and grabs me off the toilet.  You know, a little Chamorro guy too, I thought he was going to be cool.  What are you doing? Oh, using the  bathroom.  I don't give a F and then he just grabs me and I was like, man, I go back and you know, you got those skid marks just hanging out the next day.

And of course, you know, they got the tornado going on.  So somebody else got blessed with those.  Yeah, that's just one of the memories I was, I was older when I went in, I was like 21, 22. So I, I kind of flew under the radar as much as I could. A big one for me,  like.  It, I still reflect and just laugh of like how creative the DIs would be, which is,  you know, the things they would say they would know when they were being like funny and just trying to get dudes to break, right?

So then they could just have more games to play.  And so I just, I remember one time the DI came out and he was like, Hey, recruit so and so, you know, come to the quarter deck,  bring this. And he was very specific, bring this and this. And he showed up with like completely two foreign things. And he was looking at them all stupid, like,  Oh, okay.

You guys must have lost your minds. And so collectively as a company, we got to crawl around on our hands and knees for hours looking for this recruits mind because he lost his mind and we clearly did too. And I'm just sitting there and I'm just like, this is the dumbest thing I've ever done in my life. 

And I just can't help but laugh, you know? And so I just think it's about the games that we're all well aware of, you know, I still crack up cause I'm like, okay, you come up with that on the fly. And you made like a hundred kids crawl around  looking for nothing. So one experience that I had was,  it was, it was close to going to bed, right?

And one of them, the drill instructors told me to get in my pillowcase.  And you know how small the pillowcases were, right? And, and the whole time I was going, aye aye sir, aye aye sir. While I was trying to fit my whole body inside this,  this pillowcase. So that was very traumatic for me. , at the time I was 17, I turned 18 when I was in training,  but as a 17 year old kid being told to do something that was totally  uncomfortable and you know,  it's way out of, you know, it was totally different for me.

But  Jake, how would you rate your overall experience as a, as a Marine? How many years did you serve?  I did eight years.  I think overall.  I was a good Marine. I can reflect on that. Like, stayed out of trouble. A  lot of that's because I didn't get caught. But, you know, stayed out of trouble. , but even in the Marine Corps, like, especially in the infantry, like,  there is a pack mentality there.

Like, it's very, very tribal. Even from, like, platoon to platoon, squad to squad.  And so, like, my approach to people in the Marine Corps, especially because I try to pay attention to the guys who are senior to me and, like, listen to what feedback they would give.  And recognizing like being a squad leader is an example.

Like I may have to ask these dudes to like sacrifice their life.  And so I never wanted to like belittle or like treat these dudes less than human. Like I would hold people accountable. Right. I would definitely stay in that space, but I didn't go out of my way to mess with people, like how we've seen NCOs and, you know, and just Marines try to be that tough guy. 

And because I took that approach a lot of times I'd catch heat for it. Like I'd get made fun of, or like. My peer group would try to like, you know, make comment or whatever, but my career, I thought it was really good. Um, a struggle for me, though, was when I had applied for the job that I'm currently doing, you know, I was waiting for word and it finally came back and I was actually out there in 29 palms and I was with, uh, 3rd battalion, 4th Marines getting ready to deploy  and.

You know, I come back to the first store and I said, Hey, you know, this job I applied for came through, you know, won't start till X. So I'd like to still deploy with the company. I just need to come back early and do terminal. And he was like, well, you can either extend for a year or we're going to fap you out.

And I was like, first, I don't, I  want to go, like, I'm not saying I'm trying to get out of deployment. Just let me come back. And he's like, no, here's your choices. I'm like, well,  I guess you have to fat me out then.  And it was like, it crushed me dudes. Cause like  I had pride in myself and being a good Marine, always trying to like sell and do all the things.

And as soon as I told him I wasn't going to play ball, I was fapped out to the freaking, uh, hobby shop on base like the next week  and it like, like I wouldn't do a depression because I had identified and like created this personality around being a Marine that when it was no longer me being a Marine, like I didn't know what to do with myself. 

It was really hard. And so that was kinda the way I got out, you know, uh, it was the longest I've ever been home with my family in the Marine Corps because I was at the gym and at the base hobby shop, but  it was just a weird space to be in.  And what was your atmos again?  Oh, three 11 infantry.  And  where have you been deployed to? 

Uh, I went to Iraq for the initial invasion. So when we crossed the line in 2003. Our battalion was the last infantry battalion to not rotate back. So we were supposed to be there, you know, the six to eight months like everybody else, and we ended up staying closer to a year.  , so I haven't been deployed,  during my time in, I did five years, , I was a Marine in the Air Wing,  so I was a 63 22, I was fixing helicopters as an avionicsman.

So most of my time I did sea deployments, so I've been throughout Asia.  I have no experience or  know nothing about the deployments.  Uh, especially.  For you guys who have been deployed to the desert in the Middle East. , how was your experience being deployed there?

 so mine was wild. Uh,  because it was literally, hey, go to Kuwait, see what happens. Hope they  stop acting the fool and maybe we'll come home. And then it was very quickly, you know, decided that's not going to happen.  So we crossed the line March 19th and, you know, our unit took...

The Ramalya oil fields.  So for anybody who claims that the war was nothing for oil, like I was there, we didn't start filling up trucks of oil and sending it back to the states, so I don't know what we did with it, but I'm not sure that's what we did.  Um,  and then we just kept pushing. It was a lot of, you know, drive here, get out, do some work.

Um, we took Al Qut, which is south of Baghdad,  crossed into Baghdad over the Euphrates, got in some good gunfights there,  um, took Baghdad University.  stayed there for a while. And then  when the war was air fingers over, we went into security and stability operations. And so they started throwing everybody all around the country to basically  be, you know, local police forces, you know, hold the continuity of the country down.

So it didn't go haywire like during the invasion.  Uh, so I was in on the jaw for a while,  which is where Muqtada Al Sadr and his homies like to hang out and cause trouble  and then spent some time in Babylon  and then We pumped from Babylon back to Najaf and then came home. So I was all over the place, but it was wild, wild west.

I mean,  our ROEs were,  if you're 16 or older and you're out after a certain time, you're up to no good and you were basically cleared hot to be engaged.  Um,  so there was a lot of uncertainty, a lot of need, even in hindsight to be very, very aware of what we were doing before we just started, you know. 

Letting a rip to somebody on the other end who may be out walking their dog, you know I mean,  but it was very chaotic very very stressful a lot of sleep deprivation  just constant. Go go go go During this these early deployments. Was there anything from your upbringing or anything that you could  call back to you?

know throughout all your life experience up to this point that kind of  Helped you during this time because you know, you're you're there during the very early times not a lot of  preparation and in terms of  Well, I guess you've infantry with the stress inoculation and being able to deal with things and adapt and of course there's that end But was there anything like when all the adrenaline from all the firefights and all that stress is died down Was there anything you think from your life experience that helps you kind of deal with being out there? 

Yeah, absolutely  Ironically the thing that I had run from for so long in my life, you know, namely about knowing my relationship with my creator You know my faith  It came full circle before I left  I transferred back to the States and I was like, you know, what I've been doing was not serving me. And so I had made a decision, Hey, it's time for me to get right with God, whatever that looked like. 

And,  you know, in that process, I met my, you know, my future wife,  you know, started really getting focused back into those things. And so like when things got real hard,  you know, when we lost people, when  the uncertainty, the op tempo and Hey, you guys done such a good job. So instead of sending you home, we're going to make you stay longer, you know, true Marine Corps fashion. 

Um,  the uncertainty what's going on back home,  infrequent, you know, calls and letters, like I really leaned heavy in those spaces of faith because,  you know, other than that, the only thing I really had was the guy to the left and right of me.  And so that was a very, very, uh, strong focal point for me during that time.

How, how would you say, or your time in the Marine Corps was like,  was it a waste of time or? Did you feel like you had a greater purpose or yet meaning  during your time served? Because for me,  if it hadn't been for humanitarian aid  missions, I think my time in the Marine Corps  would have been a waste just like working in the government job.

Like things are repetitive and you feel like you have no purpose or No mission. Uh, that's why, uh, I'm glad for my time in the Marine Corps, but  that's how I feel. If it wasn't for humanitarian aids, it would have been a waste. How did you, how do you feel about it?  So that's something I've actually struggled with here even recently. 

Um,  like I thought I'd done a decent job of kind of processing and, you know, reflecting back on my time and going,  you know,  The people we lost or the guys who came home different or broken,  like that cost was worth what we saw, right? We, you know, the country was attempting to utilize democracy in whatever fashion they could interpret it. 

And we were making headway with, you know, removing the terrorist groups that were trying to fill the vacuum of power when Saddam was taken out.  And then just,  I mean, we all know politics are politics.  And it was just like, it was really hard for me to see these areas that we had fought so hard to take. 

given back,  you know, without any checks or balances to maintain that the people who were in them were going to want to be taken care of.  And the people that had chewed that dirt hadn't done it in vain.  You know, so when Ramadi was given back when Baghdad was given back, but it wasn't given back to a  group who was ready to help the people, you know, and ready to have that country grow is basically the same thugs in different clothes. 

, and so I thought I made peace with that. And then  You know, January six happens and I'm going, what is happening to my country right now?  You know, I became very jaded for a while because it was just like, was this all a lie? Like, was this all just, you know, did I get played? Did me and my friends get played and we get to watch this all happen?

I'm like,  so there's a lot of self reflection and a lot of questions in those spaces because I really thought that I had made an impact. And looking back, I can say I did. I mean, I can think of interactions with,  you know, people that I had overseas in Iraq, you know, little kids,  you know, who were just, They were stuck in a bad spot, and I didn't choose to be there other than that's where they lived. 

And you know, I'm able to have those interactions,  and I'm hopeful that they're doing well, wherever they may be.  There was definitely this dichotomy of like, thinking I had made a huge difference, and then seeing things unfold in a way that I didn't expect,  which caused a lot of questions.  And I think the only thing that really helps me to stay grounded in those spaces is like, the freedom we enjoy in this country,  no matter what, you know, side of the aisle or whatever you think,  like, That freedom is there for everybody to use however they see fit and not for us to decide we'll only use it in these spaces, right? 

And so that kind of helped me to just kind of even out like, okay,  this has nothing to do with me and that's okay.  How about you, T?  Did you feel like your time in the Marine Corps was a waste or did you feel like you had purpose or meaning to it?  Um,  more than anything for, for me and my, 

You know, I'm grateful that it gave me a job, you know, got me out of  whatever ridiculousness I was into at the time as a, as a young fella. Um,  the relationships are the best, you know, it gave a lot of us crazy people at home. You know, a lot of us who didn't know what we wanted to do with the future held.

But, you know, the saddest part is those who didn't know what to  do afterwards.  Or at least seeing, you know, their, the landscape of the Marine Corps changed in front of them.  Having a hard time in adapting to whatever.  And I feel bad for those people. I wish they,  like, I'm fortunate to have the kind of  just roll with the punches, go with the flow type of mentality that I do.

But just seeing,   people that we used to know kind of just  change and disappear or not be the same anymore. And that's the hardest thing.  I mean, no matter what I did or didn't do, I can't, I gotta be appreciative of the  experience I got during those years.  If you're into firearms, gear, or the tactical world, you need to check out R& R Tactical. They're not just a store, they're a destination for enthusiasts and they offer an incredible range of products. From firearms and ammunition to the latest accessories, they've got it all.

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Connect with R& R Tactical, a veteran owned business at 1657 North Guardian Drive, Saratoga Springs, Utah 84045.  Call them at 801 915 1108.  That's 8 0 1 9 1 5 1 1 0 8  so Jake, you're into social media, and I see that you're the creator of Keep Walking. Could you elaborate more on that, on your role on that?  Yeah, absolutely. Um,  so I'm part of a mastermind, and  we had met in Dallas.

And in that group, I had left that, you know, week with some action items. Cause I know where I want to go in the future. I definitely have an idea in my why, but I didn't really have a lot of anything to show for it.  And,  you know, we've all heard people talk about, you know, you want to be about it, but are you actually gonna, you know, talk about it or be about it? 

And so one of the action items, one of the guys challenged me was, Hey, I want you to create content every day. He's like, could you change my life? And I'm like, yeah, absolutely. I could. That's how strongly I feel about this.  He's like, okay, do it.  I'm like, what are you talking about? He's like, I want you to change my life.

He's like, come up with something. I want you to think about it. be authentic. Something that really resonates with you  and just create every day.  He's like, and if you do this, I'll be your biggest fan. He's like, but if you don't, I'll never work with you again. And I was just like,  wow, it's like that. Like, okay,  you know, and so I'm like, got it going to work for it. 

So keep walking was born out of that.  And the reason behind keep walking,  it's multi layered. But the biggest thing is to motivate and inspire people. You know, I think about the time in the Marine Corps when we've been on those humps.  You're carrying all the gear, all the kit,  you're walking through the sand, up and down hills or whatever, right?

And  you know, you're three miles into ten miles and you got a long way to go and you start to see people drop. And  when one drops, another one inevitably drops because he sees, Oh, well he didn't get in trouble. So you just start seeing people drop left and right and the pack gets bigger in the back and they're passing gear off and all these things.

And I can reflect even in my own life in those times where I'm like, it would be easier to quit.  It really would be.  And I think like, okay, I can take one more step.  I can do that. I don't have to run. I don't have to think 10 miles ahead. I can just take one step.  And so when I think how that translates into like everyday life,  like all of us can relate with there's days that are hard.

There's days where it's like, I can't even get out of bed.  And so my encouragement to people on my page and on my platform is  just keep walking. Just take one step. And if you can't walk, crawl,  just do whatever you have to do.  Just keep pushing a little bit. You don't have to do it and rush and sprint.

Yeah.  We can all do one step.  And that really ties into, you know, normalizing and breaking the stigmas of men in the spaces that society creates for us where, hey, if you talk about the things that bother you, if you have problems or emotions,  you're weak. I mean, that permeates so strongly in the Marine Corps and even in the veteran community. 

And I have a counter message going, you're strongest you can be as a male. If you're willing to actually sit in those spaces and it can be clunky and awkward and you don't, you know, cause it really goes against everything we're taught as men.  But it'd be like telling somebody, well, Hey, ignore your legs like you have them, but  you don't get to talk about them, but everybody else does.

And so that's really where I started and it's just continued to grow. And so I created a 30 day, you know, content of 30 days and 30 ways to change your life.  Each day focusing on gratitude and, so gratitude and, you know, physical exercise, gratitude and sleep, gratitude and a healthy diet,  gratitude and  your finances, like a whole litany of things.

Because like, I've learned that  there's always gratitude around us. And if I can lean into that and look for the gratitude around me, my life immediately can go to abundance.  And now all of a sudden I don't feel like I don't have enough time, or I don't have enough money, or I'm not good enough, or all the things we tell ourselves. 

So that's really the message I'm trying to get across with Keep Walking is, like, the commonality we share is we can all take one more step.  We all have feelings and emotions and it's okay to have those things.  And since starting Keep Walking and becoming a social media creative, how has that helped you in your life? 

It's been fantastic.  Like,  there is an energy in the creative space that I don't think can be touched or, like, replicated anywhere else but in those spaces.  And there's a momentum that is gained. Like, like, I didn't know anything about doing any of this, but I was just like, okay, I committed to doing this, so I'm going to,  and just kind of find your rhythm, find your feel,  and then things start to be attracted to it, and I approached it from a space of abundance, and that's magnetic, and  the energy that came with it, it just became a catalyst for more things, and more things, and  it's just been a really powerful experience. 

Yeah, and I'm glad you found your purpose on social media. So, before we... We started podcasting. I was doing Reels and TikToks. , it became a weekly thing for me. to the point I was, I was starting to go viral, like the most views that I've gotten on one video was 2. 9 million views. And then when I got to that point, I was like,  man, I, I, it kind of, it was like a drug where you like that high.

But then you realize that it wasn't authentic.  So I'm glad that we picked up podcasting because it was more genuine. It was more authentic and I can actually be myself instead of, instead of following the trends of today, instead of doing,  voiceovers or lip syncing or.  Or acting and all that stuff that you do on Reels and Tik Tok.

So,  T, do you have any questions?  Not right now, but that's why, uh, seeing you, like, at first I got the friend request from the Keywalking page on Facebook. And I'm like, what the heck is this? You know, he had no content posted yesterday. I thought it was spam. And then I seen, you know, the mutual friends were, and I it might be somebody I know.

So I'll wait.  And then I seen he started posting content or at least the algorithm finally allowed me to start seeing videos You know shadow bands and whatnot  and you know, I was catching  The 30 days out of order so some something wrong with my Facebook algorithm algorithm Anyways,  now I seen that and then I heard about him writing the book and then you know I'm thinking about hey, that's exactly, you know, the kind of thing we try to cover and talk about Here, you know, the whole the title thing called behind the lava lava and the purpose behind that and  What Jake's trying to accomplish here is very important, especially  Coming from somebody,  you know Like him who went through the initial push and  someone that people will gravitate towards because he definitely went, you know when people tend to  Gravitate towards people who've been through hell and come out on the other side  no matter what type of  Hell  takes form, you know, people like to  they can relate to those type of things and they they gravitate and  They tend to pay attention and receive the message more openly on that end from them for themselves And I thought that was very important and cool and like man, we got to have Jake on especially him being you know, an  o3 For those who don't know what o3 is it's infantry  no matter which branch I've talked to what type of infantry grunts Certain types of grants that there's some of the most, uh,  deep intellectual individuals you speak to, , the most analytical and philosophical type of people.

And it's like, what the heck, you know, you're supposed to just be a...  You know, grunt breaking things, but then like you actually hold conversations like, man,  they definitely, well, you know, they gain experience from having to pass the time out there on patrol and on watch all the time. But, , I just thought it'd be really cool to have Jake come on and, you know, have him kind of bless us as well with his message and what he does,  his intent, you know, his journey.

So one of one of the things, Jake, that I had been. struggling with was, uh, my mental health.   That was one of the main reasons why our podcast started was addressing men's mental health. And it,  became a therapy session for  us who are inflicted with mental health  illnesses. So depression and anxiety are the two things that always hit me randomly.

 I remember   maybe a couple of years ago, or was it two, three years ago, that I had went through a phase where I had suicidal ideation, suicidal thoughts, and that kind of triggered the whole thing where I went and seek help from a VA therapist,  but what got me to the point of seeking the help of a VA therapist was when I was failing, starting to fail  my first semester  Of my third year in college, so how, how has it been for you because you're advocating for men's, , vulnerability,  trying to break that stigma.

How, how has it been for you,   especially in terms of mental health? Initially, when I, I guess, took up this  torch, this flag,  there was a lot of uncertainty, a lot of questions that I had for myself, like,  uh, very much like, you know, we don't talk about Bruno.  You know, like that whole movie hit in a different way.

Cause it's like, we all have these things,  but when I think about my peers, like it breaks my heart, like it causes anger in me that I can't count on two hands and two feet, the people I know who've taken their lives since either coming back, you know, or lost overseas, like the ones who were lost in country, like we can at least rationalize that, like you can say, Hey, war,  but  just too many,  far too many. 

And so when I think about my mental health, like.  Anybody who says that they go to war and they come back normal,  they're lying. Like you were broken before you left.  And a lot of the reason why I want to talk about these things and normalize these things is just over the years, watching guys either, you know, outright take their lives or do it on the installment plan, you know, whether they're drinking or doing drugs or, you know, go fast, don't die with the motorcycles and the cars and whatever. 

You know, seeing friends in and out of jail, in and out of rehab,  and I just have to get curious. I'm like, what happened? Like, where did it go, you know, south for you?  And I just look at the commonality. Like,  there's not a lot of things in place. Like, I'm glad, Michael, that you were able to go to the VA, you know, when your experience was what it was.

Because I know a lot of the friends that I have, like, they don't want nothing to do with the VA. Because,  you know, they don't want to throw pills at you or... You know, you try to open up and,  you get a varied response and I, and I can recognize, you know, people are people they're trying just like we are,  but it's just like, it's really hard to be on the outside looking in  and just reflecting on my own life.

Like, I came home and  like,  you know, we came home, we landed, right? Came back, hit 29 palms,  big fanfare celebration. All the families, all the people were there. We're pumped to be home.  And I remember like, you know, my father in law's there, mother in law,  my folks, you know, my wife, Jess.  And it's just like this huge high, like, Hey, we're back.

We made it.  And so the family wants to go out. They want to have fun, right? So we're down in Yucca Valley. We're trying to get some food.  And I'm sitting there and I remember just  looking around me and everybody's having a great time.  And I felt like an alien. Like, I felt like the furthest person away from, like, being home that I could think of.

It was just this really surreal,  like, experience.  And that kind of started this journey for me of, you know, for...  A decade plus of knowing that something was off, something was wrong  and not knowing how to fix it.  And so I spent many, many years filling holes in myself  and it was everything from, Oh, I'm going to go start this new hobby, right?

I'm going to go start paintball or woodworking or learn how to fish, or I'm gonna start working out all these things to try to like distract myself from what I knew was there.  And it's just like trying to hold a beach ball under the surface in a pool. Like you can do it for a while, but eventually it's going to pop up and it's going to pop up a force. 

And  it's just been really tough to like  recognize, okay,  just cause I'm not missing arms and legs doesn't mean that I haven't been impacted  and my family hasn't been impacted,  but there's that stigma, you know, I think about the times where in the Marine Corps, I did go to like, try to talk somebody.  And  at that time, if you went to try to get help, they'd pull you out of your unit. 

And so it's like, so now I want to go get help,  but you're going to pull me out of my support group. The dudes that I chewed that do that dirt with.  So a lot of guys just eat it. And so I was like, Oh, never going to do that again.  And then guys trying to get out and get jobs and knowing that you can't be discriminated against for your experiences, but seeing people be openly discriminated and not get jobs or be fired from jobs. 

And so we just  I played this game for a long time of, all right, I'm just going to distract myself. I'm going to find ways to,  you know, do my own treatment.  And thankfully I didn't go the drug or alcohol route.  I didn't go to those spaces, but I did a lot of destructive things and a lot of hurtful things that  like, I'm very lucky that I married the woman that I did because  like, she's a G, she's a real one because  in this attempt to figure out who I was and what was going on in me,  the people who love me the most are the ones I tried to avoid because I learned here.

You know, in this healing process that  don't get close to people cause they can die.  And so the very people who wanted to help me the most, I was pushing away.  And so the mental health thing is like, it's real and  doesn't have to be from a military experience. I mean, you could be in a car wreck, you could be a victim of sexual assault, you know, domestic violence, there's all kinds of things that can happen.

But  the commonality I think that we have as humans is as men is  we're not weak, like by talking about these things, like,  and I would rather, I mean,  You know, if you guys follow UFC, you know, Patty, he talked about like his, his buddy had killed himself and he was like, I would rather like sit up with you for hours and have you cry on my shoulder and talk about all these things, then go to your funeral. 

I mean, that's just real. Like,  cause I just think there's, especially coming out of  two decades of war in Iraq and that and more so in Afghanistan,  there's a need, you know, we need to start having these conversations and encouraging each other instead of going, oh, well. I'm not as bad as this guy, and so I just eat it until it turns into something terrible.

Thanks, thanks for sharing, Jake. And  to our listeners, especially all the men out there, it's never weak  to seek help when you are struggling. Whether it's from your peers, your friends, or even a therapist. There's a stigma around  seeing a counselor or a therapist. It's not what you think. , once you find the right therapist to help you, um, that's when you'll start improving your mental health, uh, and getting the help that you need.

Uh, it's okay to shop around for the right, , counselor or therapist, , just to, to help you out. Cause we, no one wants to see you, , struggle alone. No one wants to hear that you passed away from a. From a poor choice that you've made, especially when it comes to ending your own life. And,  , just know that, um, there is always someone out there to, to listen. 

This, there's always a, a ear out there to listen to, to what you are going through. And, and if you want someone, there's always behind the lava lava to reach out to, reach out to us if you need someone to talk to.  So Jake, can you tell us about  the book that you're writing? Yeah, absolutely. , so it follows the theme of my social platforms.

The title of the book is Keep Walking,  a Marine's, you know, journey home from combat  because it's been one of those experiences that, you know, I  crossed the line of 2003. We're looking at 20 years.  And I feel like I'm just now able to feel like I'm home again. So it's been a long walk.  It's been a very long walk.

And so in that book, I definitely talk about my experiences because experiences shape us, you know, they have to.  And so I reflect on the times where, you know, I tried to fill the holes and all the things and  just the insights and the feelings and  the uncertainty and oftentimes feeling lost  and then the growth and the progression of healing. 

Because my message is there is hope, there is healing, and we can all be redeemed from the things that we feel like maybe are too much.  Because once we get to the other side of that, especially when you know you don't have to do it alone, like to your point, Michael, like there's always somebody who's willing to listen.

Somebody's willing to help.  Like there's so much power in people and in this journey I'm learning that more and more there's this whole group of people who are like waiting for you and cheering you on that you don't even know yet.  They just want to see you win. They want to see you kill it. They want to see you be that true person that they know you are. 

And we just have to start peeling it back and figure out who we are. yeah, so for the people watching this, I just want them to be aware that, uh,  when Jake went,  it was the early push and just how there was nothing really established out there in the Middle East.

While they went out and started, you know, planting roots and whatnot. Um, when they came back.  There is also nothing for them here, you know, in those terms of recovery and helping them actually, you know, bring themselves back from that combat zone.  what I want to ask is  kind of going back to your 30 days of gratitude  because I, I know you, you're doing that to change other people's life, but it's also, you know, for you, for you, for yourself.

Was there any out of those 30 days? Was there any particular day that kind of  highlight?  That you would highlight that kind of  you saw your biggest improvement or biggest kind of  like a  Eureka moment Yeah, absolutely. I just want to I want to pull it up because  you know, I have him a chronological on  On Instagram.

So I just want to look because it's  it's the day that focuses on avoiding negative news and media  and when I was recording that day,  so I was thinking about the message that I wanted to share because  I mean, we see it all around us. I mean, he has even referenced Palestine and Israel,  like  that's just a terrible situation for everybody involved. 

And I think about the times where I've been sucked into, like, seemingly the world is on fire. Everything's falling down around me and it's really hard to have hope in those moments.  And I felt very strongly, very compelled that,  okay, yeah, let's talk about this. Let's have gratitude and let's avoid and abstain from negative media sources from a time if you can. 

And then the prompting came was, but talk about the other news.  And so it was, in other news, you know, people were healed from, healed from cancer today. In other news, relationships were mended. And in other news, people found their voice and their calling and they stepped into that power.  You know, in other news, people did something kind for somebody else. 

And it's just like, it's really about how we frame it. And that video, you know, I was almost done with the 30 days, but I got emotional with that video because it was just like,  that's true, you know, that, that's real.  And it's just like we live in this world that has so much abundance and  ability for to live in that energy. 

But I think how often in my own life I've willingly kind of given away my agency or my choice  and just get sucked into something else, you know,  and they're both magnetic. Like the negativity and all the things that we see around us, they just, they feed off of each other. And that just brings more and more and more. 

But conversely, the positive and the gratitude side of it, like.  It's also magnetic and it has a power that I think, like when we tap into it,  we can just, we can elevate and move above our old selves and the things that maybe  we recognize we want to change about ourselves, but maybe don't know how. And so for that day specifically, I can't think of the day that is, I know it's late twenties,  but it was gratitude and avoiding abstaining from negative media and then just flipping the coin and going, but in other news.

All these great things happened today.  I'm about to comb through that content, but, uh, one of our listeners submitted a question.  They asked, uh...  Who's your favorite sister? I'm going to have to go with Natalie.  All right. Listen, you heard it, Natalie. So Jake, what, what do you hope  your readers take from your book?

Once you get it out there,  my biggest hope, my biggest takeaway  is that it opens up at least conversation, right? Maybe it disarms and lets people drop walls.  So they're willing to take that next step, whether it's.  Hey, let me start exploring what's going on in my life. The things that I'm holding onto that maybe anchor me because I feel like it's safety, but it's actually holding me back from what I really could be doing in my life. 

Um, taking that next step to maybe seek counseling or therapy,  or even just making that directional shift towards healing, and it can look different for all of us, but that's my ultimate goal.  Like I recognize not everybody's going to have been to combat. Not the point. I only tell the stories in those spaces because it had a huge impact in my life. 

But I hope that the commonality of being mortal and recognizing that we all go through things,  but we also have the ability to choose,  is what I hope people will take from it. Do so, really think your mission is important, the goals you're setting, and I think you're doing an excellent job so far. 

Um,  and I think people can really take and really learn and grow from this, but I want to know from... From all that you're doing now and learning and growing and evolving,  how, while doing this,  uh, while writing your book and doing the 30 Days of Gratitude, how has that helped you in your role as a father and a husband?

No, I love that question.  It's definitely helped me to realize that  there is scarcity in life, but I can choose to be there or not.  Because, you know, Jess and I have talked, like our kids at our ages were. We got one kid going here, one kid doing this, and two doing this, and so we're all over the place sometimes.

And it can feel like a lot. And then that's just outside of the house, you know, we're not talking about trying to get school done or meals or,  you know, filling needs of everybody, including ourselves.  But in the space of like really being in a creator, you know, spirit,  my kids have asked a lot of questions and they've been paying attention, you know, some of them have been following on Instagram, you know, they give feedback, Hey, I thought that was cool. 

Have you done your post today? You know, they're asking questions,  but I think for me as a dad, as a father, it's helped me to be an example of  like, you don't have to have it all figured out. I think sometimes we portray that life before we make the next step, you got to have a, B and C and D identified and then a back plan for that. 

And I'm learning more and more like. It doesn't have to be perfect, like you don't have to wait, just go and it's going to develop in front of you.  And obviously that's balanced with don't be reckless. You know, I'm not going to quit my job and, you know, throw it all to the wind, hoping that it lines up.

But,  you know, I'm seeing them  embrace this space and it's helped me to improve my communication with my kids, with my wife, Jess.  Um, you know, I have to give a huge shout out to her because I tell everybody.  Jessica is like my curator and gatherer of all good things in my life.  And she's been that way since I've known her. 

She's always fine. Hey, have you heard this? Hey, check this out. Look what I found on YouTube. Check out this book. And it's really brought us closer together because now we're sharing in this growth together.  And so I have big dreams. I have big hopes with these things. But  I really appreciate how it's helped me to be present with my kids.

And it's helped me to encourage them to look for gratitude even in things that maybe don't feel So abundant in the moment.  So it's been a really cool opportunity. And that's amazing. Amazing. Thank you for sharing Jake. And a question before we close it out, we'd like to ask our guests this, do you have any questions for us  behind the lava lava? 

I do. So I know you guys have been doing this for a little while. What has been the response from the Polynesian or Islander community, and then even outside of those spaces, like, what's the feedback you guys get?  It's an interesting, interesting one is somebody  of Italian descent.

He, he really liked our, the way we talk about customs and traditions in our households growing up and, you know, it was like, man, that was very similar to me, you know, in my traditional Italian family and you know, the way they handled things with  the laying on of hands, you know, that was, that was their form of communication rather than,  you know, actual  discussion and teaching.

You know, verbally, but, uh, it's been cool to listen to that and just  talking to random people, like people you wouldn't think, listen, that are, you know, fellow Pacific Islanders and then like, Oh, man,  you know, like what you guys do. I'm like, Oh,  uh, appreciate you,  you know,  uh, really mad. I just do this to hang with the boys.

Like, I still wish we got some of the  people that were here early on with us, but  It's cool to see, you know, the homies doing good. overall, the... Support has been  positive.  We haven't gotten much negative responses to those to the podcast and the content that we put out.  And what I'm glad for and what I'm grateful for is  it's not the content and The podcast is not reaching only Pacific Islanders, it's reaching people outside,  the Pacific Islander, um,  what's the word, diaspora, or  just outside, people who are not Pacific Islanders. 

So, I'm just glad we're reaching, uh, veterans, especially we're reaching people who are going through, The same problems that we're going through, especially when it comes to men's,  , mental health. , that's one of the topics that  people, like, reach out to us and say, Hey, we go through the same things. When it comes to fatherhood. 

Discipline, marriage, depression and,  and suicide and all these things, a lot of people can relate to the content that we're putting out. So,  , yeah, that's, that's how it's been. Uh, we've been recording  for over a year.  It's close to being two years, but it's almost February. So  it's going to be two years in February next year.

So we're just glad that we've been able to keep this consistent and keep this going, especially with our.  With our group  yeah, it's overall been positive and we're just glad to be able to do this, , to keep our  group close and to,  you know, basically,  like I said, it's, it's, it's a therapy for me and I'm glad to keep in touch with the guys. 

So that's, that's what I think about the podcast so far. I love that. So Jake, any shout outs? Any shout outs before we close and where people can find you?  Um, so  again, shout out to you guys. You know, I'll show it. You know, shout out to you guys behind the Lava. Lava. Thank you for having me. You know, I appreciate the opportunity to chop it up with you guys. 

, as far as where they can find me, you can find me on YouTube,  Instagram, or Facebook. All with the same, uh, you know, handle. It's at. Keep walking. Uh, there's a couple that may pop up, but you'll know me from the other ones because it's going to be a picture of the clouds with the sun pushing through.  I think that has a nice analogy to it.

And you know, shout out also, there's some other places I've been featured with, uh, absolute motivation on YouTube. I don't know if you guys, you know, have a certain playlist or whatever, but when you work out,  I've changed mine since finding these guys. Um, they've given me some platforms to speak on.

But absolute motivation has been fantastic for workouts because there's nothing but pumping you up, right? Like they're bringing all types of speakers, you know, everyone from James Dixon to Goggins to  Jordan Peterson and in between, there's just nothing but people talking positivity in your ear while you're hitting those reps and it hits different for whatever reason.

So if anybody wants to check them out, that's again, absolute motivation on YouTube. It's a great platform.  and again, I just, I appreciate you guys.  I really do. This has been cool to be able to sit and talk with you guys and, you know, learn about you and just have this opportunity. Yeah, we  really appreciate  you.  I think you have the personality for whatever you're doing to really grow and bring people in.  tHis mental health space. I want everybody to know it's not, it's not just for men, not just for veterans. The way Jake approaches it is for everyone  and I know  we hear mental health so much, you know, those type of  topics and people might roll their eyes getting tired of it, but I mean it needs to be brought up more because it's still an issue, right?

And just because you may not listen to  This one person, you know, somebody will,  you know, there's, there's a person for everybody, somebody to gravitate to and for the message to reach them. And I believe, you know, Jake will reach a lot of people. So, thanks for joining us, man. It's awesome to see you doing this. 

Thank you. So thank you for tuning into this episode of behind the lava lava.  If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to follow. Behind the love lover and leave us a review and thank you for joining us. We hope you found this interview informative and insightful until next time.